In music, what are my Top5 guilty pleasures? Hmmmmmmm.......
What is it about an artist/band that would cause you to classify them as a guilty pleasure? The topic arose a while back as my brother, Frank (shoutout)and I were driving home from Fort Worth listening to some great music on my Sirius/XM radio. After an hour of listening to the All Elvis Channel (ch.18), my brother managed to flip the dial without receiving a verbal lashing. The sweet melody of "Mona Lisas and Madhatters" played on the radio. "Good song," Frank said. "Great song," I concurred. We both agreed that we should leave the dial on this Elton John classic. Moments later, the question arose that has inspired me to Jive for the first time on my website. My brother stated that he considered Elton John somewhat of a guilty pleasure. I completely disagreed."Why so?", he asked. At that time I couldn't come up with a satisfying answer. So here we are, weeks later and I have decided to list some guidelines to follow when trying to decide if your liking of an artist/band should constitute some feelings of guilt. And here...we...go...
It is more than likely a guilty pleasure if:
-The artist in question competed on American Idol
-The artist's music is very popular among teenagers
-The artist does not write their own songs
-Their brand of country music is extremely popular in Nashville, Tennessee
-If you are somewhat embarassed to admit you like the artist
It is more than likely not a guilty pleasure if:
- The artist in question has been inducted into the Rock n'Roll Hall of Fame
- Their music has been featured prominently in Cameron Crowe or Martin Scorsese Movies
- The artist writes their own songs
- They refuse to allow their music to be used in commercials
Of course there are exceptions to every rule. "Like a Rock" was used by Chevrolet for years and years. But, do I consider Bob Seger to be a guilty pleasure? No, I don't. John Mellencamp...absolutely not. However, if an artist refuses to sell their music to big corporations, there is a very good chance that their music is bonafide.
A few days after the issue was first brought up, a friend asked me if I would feel a little uncomfortable playing an Alanis Morissette album while hanging out with my buddies. I told him that I wouldn't, stating that her international debut album, "Jagged Little Pill", was one of the greatest albums of the 90's. However, I was not the best person to be asked the question, being that in the past, I've had no shame in rockin' out to "Mambo No. 5" while running on the treadmill. But I could see his point. Here we had a beastly, bulging, high school football coach that probobly showers with Lava soap, admitting that he would feel a little uncomfortable playing Alanis' music in a room full of dudes. I definately see his point. As much as I might disagree with his hesitation in playing her album in public, I cannot deny that "embarassment" is definately featured in my criteria above.
So in conclusion, I hope that you find my personal guidelines helpful in deciding if you should readily admit to being a fan of one's music. I suppose it's time for me to do just that.
So...in music, what are my Top5 guilty pleasures?
5. Big and Rich - Ouch. That kinda hurt to admit.
4. Kid Rock - He borrows famous guitar riffs, shamelessly name-drops, and makes music for the sole purpose of selling records. I dig it...just don't feel good about it.
3.Toby Keith - This is a controversial entry for sure. When trying to decide if he qualifies, think of "I Wanna Talk About Me."
2. Andrew W.K. - Party Hard!
1. Shania Twain - Guilty as Charged
Now it's your turn to confess. No worries,we're all friends here.
Until next time...
Demand Satisfaction,
CWC
53 comments:
Off the cuff...
5) Hootie and the Blowfish
4) Avril Lavigne
3) Ace of Base
2) Nelly Furtado
1) Hilary Duff
Not sure about Hootie, but Kyle thought they qualified. Im pretty sure the others definitely qualify.
While perusing my itunes, I realized that i am truly a music elitist. Almost 4000 songs and no guilty pleasures. Jewel (she IS on Dancing with the Stars) is the closest thing I got.
Well, from my point of view a guilty pleasure, especially for music, is relative. By relative I mean this, A song becomes a guilty pleasure solely if it enduces embarrasment upon yourself when others here it, or in certain situations. This view for me in turn come from my way of looking at music, and that way is one song at a time. I don't have a particularly liked genres or artisits, it is about individual songs. In the end if the song embarrases you in a particular situation then that song is a guilty pleasure during that moment.
The theory of relativity applied to guilty pleasures. Genius!
However, if I listened to Big Pimpin' by Jay-Z in front of Mom and Dad, it would cause ample embarassment....but would not constitue a guilty pleasure, right?
Avirl is definantley on the list. Anger with no reason. There is no way I could put Atlantis on with the guys. Big and Rich are catchy but terrible. I have to throw Sugar Ray in. Not exactly musical geniuses. Last I would have Celtic Woman. Beautiful, classic, and no way that I would listen in front of anyone.
Atlantis Morissette?
I agree Kyle, your Jay-Z scenario would not constitute labeling it a guilty pleasure. Kirk, I don't agree that Sugar Ray should be considered. I along with everyone I know listened to them openly in the late 90's. I think "Atlantis" should be removed from contention. Avril L. also. What female artists could a grown man rock out to without feeling embarassment? Joni Mitchell...Lucinda Williams?
Hey fellas...As I've always said, a man's conscience is merely the anticipation of what others will think. With that said, let me present this scenerio that applies to this subject: I am a big fan of The Smiths/Morrissey (no, Kirk, no relation to Atlantis haha)and NO ONE can deny their "legitimacy" or status as a legendary and influential group. However, I would be fairly embarrased if a dude walked into the room and found me chilling out to one of those ultra sensitive (dare I say..wussy) songs such as "How Soon Is Now" or "Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now."
So I find myself (gasp!)kind of agreeing with Mr. Stewart that the definition of "guilty pleasure" in music IS subjective.
In the rich underbelly of indie rock, there are plenty of chicks that grown men can rock out to (Land of Talk, The Heartless Bastards, ect). Do you think their is some gender bias to guilty pleasures? If you are a man listening to a chick sing, I think you are much more likely to have feelings of guilt.
And I disagree Christopher, Sugar Ray should be considered a guilty pleasure IN THIS DAY AND AGE along with Hootie. We aren't living in the 90's anymore. If you are still listening to music over a decade old, the artist must be, to use Frank's word, legitimate. These two are not.
And by the way, there is nothing wrong with listening to The Smiths Frank, nothing at all. "There Is A Light and It Never Goes Out" has to be considered one of the all-time great songs.
Kyle...So if a band is no longer popular then they are considered? Does that mean that every Hair Metal band is now a guilty pleasure? Skid Row? Motley Crue? Quiet Riot? Randy "the Ram" would totally disagree...that's for sure. Why don't you other guys weigh in on the Sugar Ray debate...
Yes Kyle, I think you are right on the money about guys feeling guilty for listening to female bands/singers. It's just a sorta "male macho" thing that is admittedly unfortunate but nevertheless unavoidable. So let's take a stand here: Chris: listen to "Atlantis" all you want...Kyle, crank up Heartless Bastards (who rock BTW!)...Brent, keep rockin to Hello Saferide...BJ, don't be ashamed of your Dolly Pardon...and I'll continue to swoon over Zooey Deschanel.
Randy "the Ram" also hated Kurt Cobain and Nirvana....
I can't comment on your Hair Metal band arguemnt because I've never been immersed in it. I'm sure like any other genre you have your heavy-weights and flag-bearers and you also have your light-weights and powder-puffs (think the Pumpkins compared to Sugar Ray). Popularity or loss of it has nothing to do with it.
Hate to post twice in a row, but I thought this pertained to the subject (at least tangentially.)Hope you find it as devastating as I did:-)
http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008/01/30/40-indie-music/
"If you mention a band you like and the other person has heard of them, you lose. They own you. It is essential that you like the most obscure music possible."
hahahahahahaha!
Sugar Ray is a guilty pleasure, I liked them too but that doesn't make it right. Just off the top of my head.
5. Taylor Swift - writes her own stuff and all but really...
4. Backstreet Boys - you will be singing their songs all day...jr kostiha knew what he was talking about
3. Limp Bizkit
2. Icy Hot Stuntaz
1. Maroon Five
Dolly Pardon, Frank. "Now that Duffy has relinquished his King Bonehead crown, I see we have an heir to the throne! I'm sure the word you were looking for was" Parton, ha ha. Anyhow, I'm not ashamed of Dolly Parton, Frank. I will gladly listen to or play "Jolene" in front of anybody, and enjoy it for the great song it is.
Joe. Limp Bizkit? Now thats hardcore my friend.
Joe..I'm with ya...I dig Limp Bizkit also. Sure, Fred Durst's lyrics are like those of a schoolboy who just learned cuss words for the first time, but there's some really catchy songs there!
By the way...I see your Bizkit and I'll raise you a Marilyn Manson. I ain't proud of it, but I like a good number of their songs...Flame away!!
And for the record..I LOVE 70s music (the tacky ones you see on infomercials late at night)
Compiling my list, I realized what a musical Philistine I am.
5)Jimmy Eat World (Rationale: It is usually labeled in the genre of "emo")
4)Audioslave (Rationale: Supergroup reduces band's legitimacy, folks weigh in on this)
3)Coldplay (Rationale: "You know how I know you're gay? You listen to Coldplay.")
2)Papa Roach (Rationale: It just doesn't feel right)
1)Fallout Boy (Do I need to give a rationale?)
Shoutout to Weezer for once being a respectable band that I evangelized to my friends about, and then they totally sold out and I'm sure that many of my friends still think of me as a Weezer fan, which is disheartening due to anything "Green Album" and beyond.
I have some even worse guilty pleasures than these, but I listed the ones that have endured a bit longer than just a passing phase.
Point of discussion: Should the 'Supergroup/Superband' clause be appended to the guidelines?
There you have it. Murder me.
Yes DG!! Coldplay was one that I immediately popped in my mind when this discussion started. But then I thought, "how in the hell can the biggest band in the world be a guilty pleasure?" I reconciled my guilt by convincing myself that any dislike for Coldplay must be due to my "indie mentality" that automatically discredits any act that has been fortunate enough to reach mainstream acceptance. (I am working to overcome this handicap though!)
As for the "supergroup" question, they SHOULD be easy to like due to the all-star membership, but look at some of the supergroups in history: Cream, Crosby Still Nash & Young, Travelling Wilburys, Highwaymen, Velvet Revolver....and Zwan (pointed out just for you, Danny.)
I think those bands are not a guilty pleasure...BUT they cure OUGHT to be good and easy to like..there's no reason to suck at all when you assemble such talent in one place to record.
One more thing...
If you consider Audioslave or Velvet Revolver guilty pleasures, then you have to also group Van Halen (w/Sammy Hagar)in that same category...an established band changes singers while maintaining the same core group. Just a thought.
BTW...I love "Van Hagar" and will not apologize...even better than w/David Lee Roth IMO!
Just a knee-jerk reaction, but I wouldn't consider jimmy eat world or coldplay a guilty pleasure.
Here's another good question? If you are a fan of a group, aren't there gulity pleasures within each artist's body of work? For example, if you consider yourself a huge springsteen fan, wouldn't listening to anyting off of "Born in the USA" be a guilty pleasure within the springsteen genre? Take Weezer for instance. Nobody would consider Blue, Pinkerton, or Green guilty pleasure material. If a band produces 3 great albums, do they get a free pass?
When's the next jive chris?
I will talk Jive when I feel inspired to do so and I can't say when that will be. I don't think this topic has run its course yet. This is some interesting banter...By the way, an artist always has the freedom to try something different without blame...unless you're Chris Gaines. The Boss is innocent of all charges.
I agree with you Chris, but did you feel a bit guilty at the springsteen concert admitting that Thunder Road was your favorite song and not some more obscure springsteen song? Would Thunder Road be considered a "guily pleasure" amongst springsteen fans?
I look back on that answer with complete and utter shame. It has been nine years and I still think about what I should have said instead. Could I have given a worse answer? Maybe...but only if I said my favorite was "Born In the U.S.A." You are seeing Springsteen this Sunday...do you have an educated reply when someone asks you the same question? If so, what song are you gonna lie and say is your favorite? Any respectable Bruce fan knows "Thunder Road" is the best but has more sense to admit that it is their personal favorite.
Good point Kyle...as a long time Metallica fan, I remember a time when I didn't want to get caught listening to The Black Album although it was (and is) one of my favorite albums of all time. This was because most people I knew only knew of this particular record while I knew that the band had tons of other great stuff out there.
Maybe this was my attempt to set myself apart as a "real fan" and thus superior to the ignorant masses.
Perhaps all of us just want to set ourselves apart from the crowd and establish a small personal niche...and since music is one of the most important thing in our lives (or at least something that we appreciate more than the majority of folks), it is the easiest way to accomplish this. I'm guessing that only musical snobs such as ourselves have even considered the very notion of something being a "guilty pleasure."
I think the DawBro's (yes, I went there) can appreciate this:
Regarding having "a guilty pleasure within the catalogue of an otherwise Non-Guilty Pleasure Artist"....
For me the ultimate disgust of someone who names the most mainstream/popular song is when I mention liking Smashing Pumpkins and someone replies with "Oh yeah, they sing that 'Rat in a cage' song!"
IT'S BULLET WITH BUTTERFLY WINGS DAMMIT!
first off i don't think coldplay is a guilty pleasure...they are pretty good...one line of dialog from a movie shouldn't make them a guilty pleasure....
second I don't really agree about the whole Bruce debate...if they are your favorite artist you can like whatever you wish...
I mean better man is the most over rated song pj ever put out but that is just personal bias... if you like it you like it...
and really which one of us didn't say something ridiculous in the last 9 years? from tyrus thomas to 5th and Calhoun....we all have our moments...
you were right chris, this topic has not run its course. and my substitute answer will more than likely be "This Hard Land." I know Frank will like that answer because The Boss wrote that song about him and Frank. Is that suitable enough?
DJ, great point about song titles. nothing is worse than that. nothing.
5th and Calhoun. It had to be brought up.
I think all the debate is really helping to prove my point about just how relative a guilty pleasure is. It really is a joy to watch. However, I guess I'll play along for the moment. The only thing that I can think that would embarras me to play in front of you guys is "Just Like Heaven", the Cure. So there, now I've add to the game.
How the Icy Hot Stuntaz have been continually passed over by mainstream music fans is beyond me. Possibly one of the biggest crimes in music. I have one word to describe their lyrics: poetry.
Ok, here is another question? Who are some legitimate artists (with respectable catalogues) that their most popular mainstream song is actually their best song. Possibilites:
REM--Losing My Religion
Counting Crows--Mr. Jones (wouldnt that be their most popular?)
Creed--Arms Wide Open (joking)
Now hold up, Flapjack. Do we really want to cover all aspects of music in my very first Jive? It's an intersting topic but it strays a little too far from the subject at hand. BTW..."This Hard Land" would be an educated and respectable response.
BJ,
Thanks for the mental image of you relaxing in bed listening to "Just Like Heaven." I was not aware that anyone from Knox County was allowed to listen to the cure????
Chris maybe I should really go for the musical elitist attitude and say something like this,
"I tend to lean toward early springsteen, pre-Nebraska. If pressed I'll have to go with Out in the Street....the acoustic version preferably off of a 1980 tour bootleg."
BJ,
Thanks for the mental image of you relaxing in bed listening to "Just Like Heaven." I was not aware that anyone from Knox County was allowed to listen to the cure????
Chris maybe I should really go for the musical elitist attitude and say something like this,
"I tend to lean toward early springsteen, pre-Nebraska. If pressed I'll have to go with Out in the Street....the acoustic version preferably off of a 1980 tour bootleg."
Here's a sub-question that crossed my mind: does an artist become a guilty pleasure if you simply like one song of theirs, or is it required to like several songs before they can justifiably be classified as so?
How did I miss the comments section? I been to the site many times but never knew this existed.
An artist should not be considered a guilty pleasure because they haven't had a hit in a while (aka Hooty-one of my favorites). That would be like saying Bob Seger or Dire Straits were guilty pleasures. Or the Beatles or the Beach Boys were guilty pleasures.
Well, Kyle I hate to think of you thinking about me in bed too, lol. However, now that I know everyone has a like of The Cure I would say my previous post is no longer valid. Also we listen to everything out west, ha ha.
Elvis can set a fire that can't be put out, he is more dynamite than freddie mercury at live aid.....
Ha Ha, bang on Joe !!!
As many of you know, watched the Boss on Sunday night. It did not disappoint.
However, he did not play Thunder Road. If an artist has a song that is considered one of the best of all-time, doesn't he have a obligation to play it. To see the Boss, and not see him play thunder road--I feel a bit slighted...
I do think there is an obligation to play your best song.But perhaps the Boss does not consider Thunder Road to be his best. After all, when Rolling Stone Magazine ranked their top 500 rock n roll songs of all time, Born to Run was ranked above Thunder Road. I understand how crestfallen you may have been not to hear it, but I think you have to give Springsteen a pass. He has too many great ones to choose from. In this instance, it wasn't like going to a Chumbawumba concert and not getting to hear "Tumthumper".
Trust me, "The Boss" never sounded better. Great concert. He actually played 28 songs....but no Thunder Road! 28 songs!
Was there a sing along to "Waiting on a Sunny Day?"
Yes there was a sing-a-long. And he brought a little girl on stage to sing the chorus. He played for 2 hours and 55 minutes!
I agree that Born to Run is considered his masterpiece. But both are considered to be 2 of the finest rock songs of all-time. As an artist, doesnt he owe it to fans who may be seeing him for the first time (me) to play those songs???
shouldn't we start another jive with this topic????
True Springsteen fans know Thunder Road is his quintessential masterpiece. However, I would bet that if you were to do a random survey asking people to name their favorite Springsteen song (without giving them a selection of choices, just off the top of their head), ThunderRoad would garner less than 10% of the vote. The general population, I would say, just aren't that familiar with it. Born to Run, Glory Days, and (gasp) Born in the USA would dominate the list in my estimation.
I agree with you Lyle. Stay tuned for a brand new Jive. It should be up tomorrow...
I agree totally, Lyle. Ill go as far to say Dancing in the Dark and Secret Garden might top thunder Road.
However, the general population doesn't go to a Boss concert, Boss fans do. And amongst Springsteen fans, if Thunder Road isn't the favorite, then it is a close second. Its like Chris once said, "If a Springsteen fan says that Thunder Road isn't his favorite song, he's just lying to himself."
Hey Dawsons,
Just curious, did Bruce play any of the Seeger Sessions songs? Also, I bet you guys must have left early and missed the encore performance of Thunder Road! (J/K)
Nope, no seeger session songs Frank. Up until Austin, he has been playing alot of songs from Born in the USA. He only played two on Sunday--Working on the Highway and Glory Days--the latter an unplanned request from a sign in the crowd to end the encore.
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